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I'm not understanding the relationship you are drawing between irregularities and Sates running thier own elections. The lack of centralized governance can create just as many problems as it solves. I do think there is some prima facie evidence that requires investigation (e.g. software issues, equal protection clause, etc.). Again, I don't believe the outcome will be changed but if something was illegal or administratively improper it needs to be addressed and remediated.

Not directed at you but at Biden...resolving political rifts? How? He and his party berated, belittled, shamed, cancelled, and dismissed almost every constituent represented by leaders on the other side of the aisle. Biden and his party demonstrated an unprecedented lack of cooperation over the last 12 years...getting progressively further apart. There is zero argument to the contrary on that point. The populous is the only body of people who can settle the divide. Politicians are presently incapable of achieving that end.

The concession speech...neither you nor I can recall that absence because I don't think it ever occurred in our lifetimes. That said, it is customary not a constitutional requirement. Trump seems to believe that the decisions of the courts may influence the outcomes. I don't. I can understand his reluctance to concede. I'[m betting we never hear one, which I think would be classless considering the custom. I am old enough to remember Gore retracting his concession to Bush.
Having worked on an election, I know you will always have problems considering the scope and logistics. Different types of problems but it makes it more difficult to visualize a mass conspiracy (would have to be gigantic to have simultaneous conspiracies or a giant one that covers all the states...).

Perhaps we need to hear LESS from politicians. Administer our respective countries and debate specific bill based on the pros and cons of the legislation: work on merits and what will be best for the most and demonstrate / justify what is being done.

And it is not just the politicians. Not sure if you saw it, but we just went through a very rapid "issue" where Whole Foods banned employees from wearing poppies in advance of Remembrance Day, but had it overturned. I guess anytime you have people with different views, there will be conflict. The challenge is how to minimize the conflict and the personal attacks, sticking to the issues. You are right, it will come down to individuals showing a basic level of respect for each other, and hopefully that basic level will grow over time.
 

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I can't remember ANY election in a democracy where the loser did not concede (gractiously or not): this is a first.
Will be interesting to watch the next 70+ days. Truly hope it is peaceful, and that all parties look to common good.
Seriously? Technically Clinton never conceded because she was crying in her hotel room and sent down her campaign manager to give hers. No, that's not an exaggeration and exactly what happened. Then she had no problem watching her supporters, for the first time, try to disrupt the inauguration ceremony, requiring a massive DC police presence to keep things civil.

You don't need to hope for this being peaceful. It will be because the people who are going to lose are not the people who hold up the No Justice, No Peace signs and do billions of dollars in property damage when things don't go their way.

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Perhaps we need to hear LESS from politicians. Administer our respective countries and debate specific bill based on the pros and cons of the legislation: work on merits and what will be best for the most and demonstrate / justify what is being done.
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Yeah, that works great until what you think is "best for the most" is substantially different from mine. Sadly we are facing a significantly increasing number of people in our society who believe that "the end justifies the means". Just ask Bernell Trammell.

BTW - if you don't think that there is a major organized effort at voter fraud, just watch the Georgia senatorial election over the next two months.

Steve
 

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Discussion Starter #123
I'm not understanding the relationship you are drawing between irregularities and Sates running thier own elections. The lack of centralized governance can create just as many problems as it solves. I do think there is some prima facie evidence that requires investigation (e.g. software issues, equal protection clause, etc.). Again, I don't believe the outcome will be changed but if something was illegal or administratively improper it needs to be addressed and remediated.

Not directed at you but at Biden...resolving political rifts? How? He and his party berated, belittled, shamed, cancelled, and dismissed almost every constituent represented by leaders on the other side of the aisle. Biden and his party demonstrated an unprecedented lack of cooperation over the last 12 years...getting progressively further apart. There is zero argument to the contrary on that point. The populous is the only body of people who can settle the divide. Politicians are presently incapable of achieving that end.

The concession speech...neither you nor I can recall that absence because I don't think it ever occurred in our lifetimes. That said, it is customary not a constitutional requirement. Trump seems to believe that the decisions of the courts may influence the outcomes. I don't. I can understand his reluctance to concede. I'[m betting we never hear one, which I think would be classless considering the custom. I am old enough to remember Gore retracting his concession to Bush.
I think the key word is retracting. As you say there is more than enough oddities in this election, to warrant an investigation, and considering the votes are so close in some of the states, the people are expecting a monitored recount and matching to voters. It may take time but is necessary. This type of closeness in votes ends up in a recount or revote for Senators and Congress. Maybe it should also be for a President. Remains to be seen.
 

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I will say I have at least 3 friends (all in different states) that checked on their mail in ballots and their votes were not counted because someone else had previously mailed in a ballot in their name... Now they are in the process of contesting it....

There absolutely is voter fraud happening.....
 

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Discussion Starter #125
I will say I have at least 3 friends (all in different states) that checked on their mail in ballots and their votes were not counted because someone else had previously mailed in a ballot in their name... Now they are in the process of contesting it....

There absolutely is voter fraud happening.....
I just hope the frauders are caught this time. We have become too complacent and are allowing the last vestige of democracy to go down. And I hope something is done. Something has to be done. After this election it is why vote anymore, The election is decided by those in control and just what we need is Hillary back in the Cabinet. It makes me sad, that we can't have an election without the games, and the whole world is laughing at us. From what they are calling us the United States of Nigeria. Same games being played.
 

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Let me guess: some of you believe in Quanon conspiracies.
 

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I will say I have at least 3 friends (all in different states) that checked on their mail in ballots and their votes were not counted because someone else had previously mailed in a ballot in their name... Now they are in the process of contesting it....

There absolutely is voter fraud happening.....
My understanding is that is where the verification process takes over. Do you have a signature block when you register to vote? We may be getting into some of that here in the future as we generally don't have mail in ballots (with some exceptions). We have a permanet voters list that get updated regularly. We have advance polls where you can vote, but need to provide appropriate ID to get your ballot, so it is pretty hard to vote twice... I have heard that some people did vote twice, but that was because they had moved, and were still on the voters list in their old area and got on again in the new area. Very limited numbers, though.
 

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My understanding is that is where the verification process takes over. Do you have a signature block when you register to vote? We may be getting into some of that here in the future as we generally don't have mail in ballots (with some exceptions). We have a permanet voters list that get updated regularly. We have advance polls where you can vote, but need to provide appropriate ID to get your ballot, so it is pretty hard to vote twice... I have heard that some people did vote twice, but that was because they had moved, and were still on the voters list in their old area and got on again in the new area. Very limited numbers, though.
Yes, the fraudulent ballots were signed... their ballots were sent to them in the mail and they filled them out and mailed them back in.... now they have to contest the signature....
 

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My understanding is that is where the verification process takes over. Do you have a signature block when you register to vote? We may be getting into some of that here in the future as we generally don't have mail in ballots (with some exceptions). We have a permanet voters list that get updated regularly. We have advance polls where you can vote, but need to provide appropriate ID to get your ballot, so it is pretty hard to vote twice... I have heard that some people did vote twice, but that was because they had moved, and were still on the voters list in their old area and got on again in the new area. Very limited numbers, though.
This goes to my prior point that centralized and distributed governance of elections creates as many issues as it solves. I do think that there was voter fraud, but I don't think there will be a conclusion that changes the outcomes of the election. It needs to be investigated to bring closure based in fact and in law. There are enough statements under oath now to warrant an investigation.

I am a patriot and will support the duly elected President. I want to be 100% confident that support goes to the right guy.
 

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Discussion Starter #130
It would seem Barr has received enough evidence that something was wrong and has allowed an investigation. So obviously there is concrete evidence, that something was amiss.
 

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They sent out millions of ballots to every Tom ,Dick,an Jane. The Mexicans that come here to work on the farms etc. received ballots. They are not U.S. citizens and don't plan on becoming citizens. The ones I know said they did not send them in.These guys are pretty honest and hard working. But you can bet the large democrat run cities there was plenty of corruption. You would have to be pretty unknowing to think there was not. If you cannot have fair elections, why vote.
 

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My biggest issue is with the sending of unsolicited ballots. Don't understand how anyone can consider that legit.

We need to make sure this BS never happens again.
 

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My biggest issue is with the sending of unsolicited ballots. Don't understand how anyone can consider that legit.

We need to make sure this BS never happens again.
Agreed 100% on unsolicited ballots. Zero reliable control mechanisms as far as I can see. But the nine states that had the unsolicited ballots would likely have gone blue anyhow; except Nevada.
 

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So now we are posting about the election?????????
What a turn this has taken!
Obviously COVID has taken a back seat now that the media has something else to focus on.... it's almost as if the media was fueling that fire....
 

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Sorry, but there is no vaccine yet. Pfizer has announced some interim results.... interim. Still undergoing stage 3 tests with nothing finalized yet. Pfizer and BioNTech Announce Vaccine Candidate Against COVID-19 Achieved Success in First Interim Analysis from Phase 3 Study | Pfizer

They still have to complete the test, then do further analysis with the FDA. Results published in peer reviewed journal for review before things move forward.

“The first interim analysis of our global Phase 3 study provides evidence that a vaccine may effectively prevent COVID-19 Many people have criticized this as science by press release rather than formal study.

The information contained in this release is as of November 9, 2020. Pfizer assumes no obligation to update forward-looking statements contained in this release as the result of new information or future events or developments. Pfizer is competing with lots of other drug companies to come up with the first viable vaccine. Being the first means they take the lead in selling up to 1.3 BILLION vaccines (at what price? $2 per dose?, $5, $74 or more???).

Development continues, but this press release does not get us any closer to a viable vaccine. Primary commentators are still saying that IF a vacine is determined to be effective, it still won't be widely available before April 2021.

We still have a long way to go before things are under control. From what I have heard, it will likely be some time next summer or fall before any potential vaccine is likley to have an effect. Remember, despite our governments giving billions of dollars to various multiple drug companies, the vaccine will have to be distributed worldwide before things can really open up.
 

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Sorry ctcdock; that was not my intention. I agree with you about the timing. I think the timing has more to do with the development of the election count . recount / status of court challenges and Pfizer looking to ensure they are front and centre of anyone from a potential new government (who will be writing the cheques for billions of dollars).
 

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Discussion Starter #140
I wonder who will be writing the checks for lawsuits against Pfizer?
 
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