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I think the assumption of how much mask-wearing is happening - particularly in the US - is vastly over-estimated. There are constantly reports of parties and gatherings where few if any masks are observed. And to think that anywhere has as much individuality as the US is just not very observant. Nowhere is ‘personal freedom’ as loudly touted and claimed as ‘the land of the free’. I haven’t heard of any other country that has politicized masks, or begun doubting their efficacy. For how many years have we trusted doctors and medical workers with our health? And what’s the number one thing doctors do when treating a patient or performing a procedure? They wear a mask. If a doctor tried to cut you open and not wear a mask, how surprised would you be? It’s because masks work and we’ve known that they work for many many many years - until this year. Until wearing one was declared to be a vote against Trump. Until wearing a mask became a symbol for being an un-thinking sheep. Until this huge event, that started in or was even caused by a foreign country, while fear and hatred of foreigners and specifically people of color has been boiling for so many years and finally has started boiling over and driving huge wedges between groups and cultures. Dealing with illness and disease has been done while covering our mouth and nose for centuries. But when it became a political issue just this year, we suddenly have doubters. Americans pride ourselves on being free, on being our own person, on not following rules, on bucking authority, and challenging status quo/traditions/accepted wisdom. This is why being called a sheep is such an offensive term and serves to rile up emotions. Everyone wants to do their own thing, be their own person, to not be seen as a follower. Combining the racist tendencies with suddenly semi-legitimate fears of foreigners is how you get where we are now - many thousands and millions of people that are not wearing masks and grasping at any explanation that exonerates them.
I really think you are way off base in stating that we in the US have "fear and hatred of foreigners and specifically people of color", and also "racist tendencies".
I grew up with foreigners in my family. My four Grandparents, and some Aunts and Uncles. I had many foreigners as customers on my paper route growing up. I did not fear any of them. You must have had a scary upbringing or did not have contact with foreigners to have such negative feelings about our country. I have lived in CT, MA, NH, and FL and have not seen this racism or fear of foreigners that you are claiming, and believe me, living in Hartford, CT, I had much contact with many different groups of people.
Slavery ended in 1865 in the USA. There presently is slavery in many parts of the world. If we are such a racist nation, we would have never elected a black man to the Presidency, and then reelected him.
 

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I think the assumption of how much mask-wearing is happening - particularly in the US - is vastly over-estimated. There are constantly reports of parties and gatherings where few if any masks are observed. And to think that anywhere has as much individuality as the US is just not very observant. Nowhere is ‘personal freedom’ as loudly touted and claimed as ‘the land of the free’. I haven’t heard of any other country that has politicized masks, or begun doubting their efficacy. For how many years have we trusted doctors and medical workers with our health? And what’s the number one thing doctors do when treating a patient or performing a procedure? They wear a mask. If a doctor tried to cut you open and not wear a mask, how surprised would you be? It’s because masks work and we’ve known that they work for many many many years - until this year. Until wearing one was declared to be a vote against Trump. Until wearing a mask became a symbol for being an un-thinking sheep. Until this huge event, that started in or was even caused by a foreign country, while fear and hatred of foreigners and specifically people of color has been boiling for so many years and finally has started boiling over and driving huge wedges between groups and cultures. Dealing with illness and disease has been done while covering our mouth and nose for centuries. But when it became a political issue just this year, we suddenly have doubters. Americans pride ourselves on being free, on being our own person, on not following rules, on bucking authority, and challenging status quo/traditions/accepted wisdom. This is why being called a sheep is such an offensive term and serves to rile up emotions. Everyone wants to do their own thing, be their own person, to not be seen as a follower. Combining the racist tendencies with suddenly semi-legitimate fears of foreigners is how you get where we are now - many thousands and millions of people that are not wearing masks and grasping at any explanation that exonerates them.
This is the most sophomoric and uninformed post I have ever read anywhere.
 

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I really think you are way off base in stating that we in the US have "fear and hatred of foreigners and specifically people of color", and also "racist tendencies".
I grew up with foreigners in my family. My four Grandparents, and some Aunts and Uncles. I had many foreigners as customers on my paper route growing up. I did not fear any of them. You must have had a scary upbringing or did not have contact with foreigners to have such negative feelings about our country. I have lived in CT, MA, NH, and FL and have not seen this racism or fear of foreigners that you are claiming, and believe me, living in Hartford, CT, I had much contact with many different groups of people.
Slavery ended in 1865 in the USA. There presently is slavery in many parts of the world. If we are such a racist nation, we would have never elected a black man to the Presidency, and then reelected him.
This is the most sophomoric and uninformed post I have ever read anywhere.


I’m dumbfounded. You both think the US has harmony between races?!?!?!? That’s too stupid. I can’t. How do you ... Nevermind.
 

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Okay folks! It is time to move these kinds of posts over to the "Honda CTX700 Lounge" because that is our off-topic section. If you have something to talk about that's not related to the Honda CTX700, that is the area to do it in. And admittedly the last few entries have "drifted" methinks.
 

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Oh Jedi - its the media that keeps hyping that different races cant get along.
People in general aren't like that. - Read that again "in general". I'm sure you'll spin what I said yet again.
Get off your social media and live your life.
And I almost was agreeing with you on your post until you went into that spin.
YOU just want to stir up controversy like every media outlet!!

NOT EVERY thing is political.
Me wearing or not wearing a mask has nothing to do with ANY political party!!! NONE!
 

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I’m dumbfounded. You both think the US has harmony between races?!?!?!? That’s too stupid. I can’t. How do you ... Nevermind.
I'm not sure how it is in Texas where you live, but where I live in Florida, Blacks, Whites, and Hispanics live in harmony.
 

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I’m dumbfounded. You both think the US has harmony between races?!?!?!? That’s too stupid. I can’t. How do you ... Nevermind.
I don't know where you are coming up with that question based on my response. I said your post was uninformed and sophomoric. If you are suggesting that somehow my opinion of your post aligns with my perspective on racial harmony in America then I, like you, am dumfounded and the parallels you have drawn are "...too stupid..." to use your words.
 

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It seems like over 150 million votes have been cast. that is an incredible accommplishment. Hope the votes are counted shortly and final determination of the election determined so you can collectively pick up, regroup and move forward.
 

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Discussion Starter #110
It seems like over 150 million votes have been cast. that is an incredible accommplishment. Hope the votes are counted shortly and final determination of the election determined so you can collectively pick up, regroup and move forward.
It seems that more votes in certain states were cast than there were voters. We shall see.
 

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Discussion Starter #113
do you have any specific reports or just allegations?
There was a news article that was talking about votes from the dead. In a way nothing new. What is new is that people seem to finally be upset with inconsistencies. Like Explorecaves said, it has been happening. The question is will it become acceptable to have a 3rd world country style election here?
 

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There was a news article that was talking about votes from the dead. In a way nothing new. What is new is that people seem to finally be upset with inconsistencies. Like Explorecaves said, it has been happening. The question is will it become acceptable to have a 3rd world country style election here?
From what I have seen, each state is different. In some of the outstanding states, decisions were made not to count any of the mail in ballots until after the election.
More Democrats voted in advance, partly to avoid the crowds, including those without any masks or social distancing, whereas Trump encouraged voters (mostly Republicans) NOT to vote by mail, but to show up and vote in person.
So many states have announced that they are following their procedures, and that all the eligible ballots will be counted. There are approved viewers from both parties watching the counts. It may take some time, but there have not been much confirmation of any irregularities,despite the rhetoric and bombast.
Your system could likely do with some improvements, but the only 3rd world related activity is the accusations of fraud and attempts by the current inhabitant of the WH to try to imtimidate others to get his way. Fortunately, the courts and state officials and, where necessary, the police, have kept things moving, albeit showly. Looks like some announcement should be forthcoming either later tonight or tomorrow, subject to process of appliable recounts and reviews.
I wish for all Americans clear decisions, clear, concise and accurate reviews by the counters and the courts, and then a smooth and peaceful transition.
 

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Discussion Starter #115
I guess it was too much to hope the process would work. The differences are too great and lead to too many problems that can be exploited. It does make me sad.
 

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........................
Your system could likely do with some improvements, but the only 3rd world related activity is the accusations of fraud and attempts by the current inhabitant of the WH to try to imtimidate others to get his way. ................
Well, although it looked like it was to help a New Jersey Democrat city councilman in the local election, he got arrested for having a box with 800 blank ballots in his mailbox.

Then there was the Michigan recount in 2016 where the careful court ordered recount showed 37% of the precincts in Detroit reported more votes for Clinton to the State Board of Elections than they had ballots filled out at the precinct.

Don't get me started on California's "ballot harvesting".

If you think that blatant voter fraud doesn't occur in the US you are seriously misinformed.

Although, to be fair, the problem is not the election process. Years ago my business professor said "If I control the information you receive, I control the decision that you will make". When the news media is willing to run Democrat campaign ads that say "If Trump's tax plan is enacted Social Security benefits will END in 2023", it's amazing how many people are still able to see through the BS.

Steve
 

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I'm not a conspiracy guy by any measure. However, it is not illogical to believe that many may have acted independent of one another to influence the outcomes of the election. That said, there are some irregularities that should be investigated. I'm unsure an investigation would result in a substantially different outcome.

Every country that I recall being represented by members here in this forum have sent men and women to fight for other countries' right to have free and fair democratic elections. We should provide that same confidence to the citizens of our respective countries.
This needs to be settled in fact or we risk far worse consequences than just a divided opinion.
 

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I'm not saying that there are no irregularities, but each state runs their own election, complete with oversight from both Democrats and Republicans and independants. If you go to court without specifics, the motions will be tossed, as they have been.
Even Fox News has recognized that Biden and the Democrats have won, subject to recounts as required, or if any substantial legal challenge emerges (none yet).

Biden had a good speech the other day. His priorities are to get a national advisory committee to provide scientifically based recommendations (based on best knowledge at the time, and as things change, so too may the recommendations); he wants to get the economy going in a safe manner, and he wants to try to resolve some of the political rifts. That last one may be biggest challenge.
I can't remember ANY election in a democracy where the loser did not concede (gractiously or not): this is a first.
Will be interesting to watch the next 70+ days. Truly hope it is peaceful, and that all parties look to common good.
 

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Discussion Starter #119
I'm not saying that there are no irregularities, but each state runs their own election, complete with oversight from both Democrats and Republicans and independants. If you go to court without specifics, the motions will be tossed, as they have been.
Even Fox News has recognized that Biden and the Democrats have won, subject to recounts as required, or if any substantial legal challenge emerges (none yet).

Biden had a good speech the other day. His priorities are to get a national advisory committee to provide scientifically based recommendations (based on best knowledge at the time, and as things change, so too may the recommendations); he wants to get the economy going in a safe manner, and he wants to try to resolve some of the political rifts. That last one may be biggest challenge.
I can't remember ANY election in a democracy where the loser did not concede (gractiously or not): this is a first.
Will be interesting to watch the next 70+ days. Truly hope it is peaceful, and that all parties look to common good.
Dewey vs Truman, Gore vs Bush, Clinton vs Trump. Those were very vociferous losers.
 

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I'm not saying that there are no irregularities, but each state runs their own election, complete with oversight from both Democrats and Republicans and independants. If you go to court without specifics, the motions will be tossed, as they have been.
Even Fox News has recognized that Biden and the Democrats have won, subject to recounts as required, or if any substantial legal challenge emerges (none yet).

Biden had a good speech the other day. His priorities are to get a national advisory committee to provide scientifically based recommendations (based on best knowledge at the time, and as things change, so too may the recommendations); he wants to get the economy going in a safe manner, and he wants to try to resolve some of the political rifts. That last one may be biggest challenge.
I can't remember ANY election in a democracy where the loser did not concede (gractiously or not): this is a first.
Will be interesting to watch the next 70+ days. Truly hope it is peaceful, and that all parties look to common good.
I'm not understanding the relationship you are drawing between irregularities and Sates running thier own elections. The lack of centralized governance can create just as many problems as it solves. I do think there is some prima facie evidence that requires investigation (e.g. software issues, equal protection clause, etc.). Again, I don't believe the outcome will be changed but if something was illegal or administratively improper it needs to be addressed and remediated.

Not directed at you but at Biden...resolving political rifts? How? He and his party berated, belittled, shamed, cancelled, and dismissed almost every constituent represented by leaders on the other side of the aisle. Biden and his party demonstrated an unprecedented lack of cooperation over the last 12 years...getting progressively further apart. There is zero argument to the contrary on that point. The populous is the only body of people who can settle the divide. Politicians are presently incapable of achieving that end.

The concession speech...neither you nor I can recall that absence because I don't think it ever occurred in our lifetimes. That said, it is customary not a constitutional requirement. Trump seems to believe that the decisions of the courts may influence the outcomes. I don't. I can understand his reluctance to concede. I'[m betting we never hear one, which I think would be classless considering the custom. I am old enough to remember Gore retracting his concession to Bush.
 
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